Curse

TavMaster-T · May 01, 2006, 03:15 PM // 15:15

/signed

Maggeus · May 01, 2006, 03:27 PM // 15:27

/signed totally...

Eviance · May 01, 2006, 06:18 PM // 18:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keilious Ahruhk

What's this? Factions now forces your team to split into squads?
Thank GOD.

I found it so annoying going into Alliance battles with my guild, then finding that I was the only monk because everyone decided that the only way to enjoy AB was as a warrior or an assassin.
So then we had random people tagging along when we were skirmishing and taking points.
Not to mention focusing on healing my team of four became annoyingly difficult when we were cramed straight in the middle of a huge party box.

I understand that you all enjoyed the chaos and mass battles of it all, but don't forget that not everyone wants to play the game in the same way you do.

In my eyes, the solution here is simple, Anet should let you choose whether to have your party box display your squad or the whole team.

I can't wait to get Factions.

Ya know.... I think you missed the whole point of 12v12.... Being a lone monk you were a lone monk for the full 12! That's why people could enter at random, and it was in cases like yours where people stray off with their own party and not help the full party - that many matches were lost.

the full 12, THAT is your team! That was the point - if you just want your four go to TA!

Quote:

Actually, I hadn't done Allaince Battle when I last posted. I think its 100 times better now, and there are no leavers. The confusion is now down by 85% aswell.

PLEASE DO NOT GO BACK TO THE OLD WAY!

See the reason why there are no leavers is ya can't see them leave your party -_- *giggles* If they aren't in your party you will never notice! Nice, now go try again *nods* cause there has already been a post about a guy going in with a team of four and he being the only one left after just a few mins... (FTL!)

shardfenix · May 01, 2006, 06:39 PM // 18:39

The way it works, if i understand correctly, is that the game takes all the full groups of 4 and places them into battle first, then groups of 3, then 2, then the single people. Changing to the way it is now prevents a guild of 12 from going in at the same time. They also seperated the groups because of heal party/aegis abuse.
However, I think the way it was in the FPE was way more fun. Maybe an ally chat or faction chat could let your army communicate, while team chat is just for your group.
It gets confusing when a random person says "cap the middle" even though we already have it. It also ruins their surprise attack.

MSecorsky · May 01, 2006, 06:53 PM // 18:53

/signed

Newer does not always equate to better.

Eviance · May 01, 2006, 07:25 PM // 19:25

I like many others just do not see how Aegis and Heal party were unfair - you guys act as though the other team didn't have access to the exact same skills- good grief!

Xellos · May 01, 2006, 07:53 PM // 19:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by JR-

Thats a retarded argument.

Heal Party and party-wide enchantments are already fairly sick in 8 vs 8, in 12 vs 12 they were absolutely insane. It needed that change.

So I agree that (as someone who plays monk) they should probably bring back the full party window. I do think it still needs seperating as far as party-wide skills go though.

The way you just said it, it makes it seem like your the type of guy that wants meat at a salad bar, or french fries at subway. Really, how do you know what A.net wanted 12v12 to be huh? Maybe it was meant to be about heal party and party wide enchantments.

If A.net made a map where there were huge amount of objects to block projectiles, would you complain about A.net needed to buff projectile skills? Seriously, this is getting silly. Accept the fact that this game is not 100% balanced in ANY mode, and that every skill is suppose to have it's niche at different dominance depending on the mode. You don't see people using cleave for PvP at all, so how come they don't nerf it? Why aren't you crying about that? Cleave fits perfectly as PvE, and that's it's niche.

Eviance · May 01, 2006, 08:04 PM // 20:04

Xellos I see what you are saying but I personally go a step further and for I think the 5th time in this thread say: How is it unfair when BOTH teams can do it if they are smart enough to do so.

It is only a disadvatange to those who don't utilize the skills given!

Why is JR as a monk NOT utilizing his skills? Does he not use them to farm, to keep his party alive... Why complain unless you feel as if you cannot do this yourself because you either lack the skill or knowledge. I say if someone can make something work for them and their team then do it!

God I know death nova hurts like a mofo but its what the skill is meant for - stop complaining and use what you were given its all equal rights - no one used any hacks to make their heal party or Aegis better than anyone elses so get over it!

Desbreko · May 01, 2006, 08:59 PM // 20:59

I played healer monk in alliance battles during the FPE, so of course I had some experience using Heal Party. And sure, it was awesome when all 12 people were within radar range to benefit from the heal, but that rarely happened any time other than when one side got pushed all the way back into its base--in which case I needed it just to keep up with the massive Edge of Extinction damage. No, the biggest use I got out of Heal Party was simply the fact that I didn't have to be at the edge of aggro range to heal someone.

So, my opinions:

No communication between 4-man squads: Bad. I really don't see how you're supposed to coordinate at all if you're completely cut off from them. Local chat doesn't cut it.

Not being able to see the other squads in the party window: Bad. I wouldn't really care too much if they were put under Allies so that party spells wouldn't affect them, even though Heal Party wasn't the "I win" button a lot of people seem to be making it out to be. But, as a monk, I need a good way to target allies in order to heal.

Only being able to enter as a 4-man group: Don't care much about this. I only ever went in guild groups during the FPE, and I doubt I'd play 12v12 all that much by myself.

Penalties for leaving: I think this should be added, but conditionally. You shouldn't be penalized if your connection drops, but if you map travel or log out normally you should have to wait a while before being able to enter another alliance battle, with the time starting from your next log in.

Aki Soyokaze · May 01, 2006, 09:10 PM // 21:10

/signed

Keilious Ahruhk · May 01, 2006, 09:23 PM // 21:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eviance

Ya know.... I think you missed the whole point of 12v12.... Being a lone monk you were a lone monk for the full 12! That's why people could enter at random, and it was in cases like yours where people stray off with their own party and not help the full party - that many matches were lost.

Playing as one massive group is only feasible in the balanced map, once you start pushing into enemy territory, the only way to turn around a match you're losing is to skirmish until you've evened the odds.
Clearly Anet believes that the "point" of 12v12 is squad based combat, considering these changes. These changes which no doubt came about from player input, if not from our regions, from Asia.
In either case, is no "point" of 12v12, everyone just plays it whatever way they like.
And for the record, we won every match we played in.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eviance

the full 12, THAT is your team! That was the point - if you just want your four go to TA!

In TA we can't take on 12 v 4 and win, in TA we can't go around tactically aiding a larger battle that we know is happening. If the other teams took a risk and didn't bring a monk, that's not my problem.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eviance

See the reason why there are no leavers is ya can't see them leave your party -_- *giggles* If they aren't in your party you will never notice! Nice, now go try again *nods* cause there has already been a post about a guy going in with a team of four and he being the only one left after just a few mins... (FTL!)

Leaving an Alliance battle is incredibly stupid as far as I can see. I mean, if you've gone so far into one, why not just finish it and get the faction at the end?
You're only going to be spending another five minutes or something waiting for a new battle to start anyway.

Tainted Ares · May 01, 2006, 09:24 PM // 21:24

/signed

Loch · May 01, 2006, 09:36 PM // 21:36

Some sort of communication for the whole team: Sure!
Showing 4 party members and an Allies submenu: Sure!
Enter the match without a team: No way.

NEWS FLASH: The objective of Alliance Battles is to capture map zones. I doubt that ArenaNet ever wanted this mode to be about a bunch of scrubs running around aimlessly through the "chaos" of more idiots. The whole point is to play as smaller teams and control the map that way. ArenaNet made these changes so that players might play the mode as intended.

Evilsod · May 01, 2006, 09:44 PM // 21:44

Perhaps if all your warriors are winging that they can't hit a target due to Aegis been spammed from the backline, they should get off there lazy ass and go attack the guy spamming it? Surely if this member is behind the Base Defender your team is winning so who gives a shit?

They're called party wide enchantments for a reason, they target your entire party! Not just the ones Anet deems it suitable to target.

EF2NYD · May 01, 2006, 09:47 PM // 21:47

I'm sure they got rid of the entire party window to fix the quitter issue. You can't see them quit so you can't complain!

Phrozenflame · May 01, 2006, 09:47 PM // 21:47

they could have one more chat tab..

Squad Chat, Team Chat...

ftw.

Merick · May 01, 2006, 10:02 PM // 22:02

/signed

Eviance · May 01, 2006, 10:05 PM // 22:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keilious Ahruhk

If the other teams took a risk and didn't bring a monk, that's not my problem.

Firstly it is if you lose!

Second I do agree that leaving in the middle of battle is stupid and I completely understand this but I still find it completely selfish not to allow everyone the chance to Alliance battle - it's been said time and again in this thread that certain classes aren't taken into these groups of 4 and by restricting it to not allow those to enter in alone kills any hope for that person of playing.

As for strategy it does work - you send a couple groups of two off to cap and have your 8man team for high defence and conquer of places like the dragons roost - it's more than a little hard to cooridinate this at this time and if your cappers run off and get killed you don't know it nor do you know if ANYONE or if EVERYONE is off doing little caps and getting slaughtered.

Personally it's looking a lot more like HoH and being LEET then having fun - 12v12 the way it was was the ultimate idea of fun!
It's not fun anymore and before if we were losing we could yell at our team and say OK get it together - and we could signal for help if a large force was about to overpower us.

And the REASON it was changed for the 12v12 I do not think it had anything to do with their tactical wants for us (that would be hampering our creativity) - it was because people were complaining about monks and such being over powered. Which again I don't understand!: Both sides had these options and if they didn't utilize what was available to them that was their fault!

It was great for my guild to be able to split into two or 3groups and hit enter at the same time with a pick up or two and hope to enter into the same battle (rarely happened but it was fun when it did).

My first time since Factions came out that I decided to check out the alliance battles and all I saw was squabbling between a bunch of players claiming to be more l33t than the others and it looked like a pissing contest!
Other poor people were begging to get a group and they were told they weren't good enough cause they weren't rank 6.....

It was fun and 90% of the players loved and enjoyed the random slaughter of either side! - But that 10% complained because either they never got monks in their groups (honestly I didn't see much difference between those that did and those that didn't), or they didn't get an MM - or they had too many casters....

Learn to take responsiblity and stop ruining the fun for other people. The sheer amount of posts in here bitching about it should say enough!.

And tell me what is the point of forming these alliances? Are they ever really going to come into play other than some people being a part of it and others not - is this something for chapter 3? Other than being able to communicate with a guild you are already friendly with they seem about pointless as far as alliance battles go.

I thought this game was about fun but you and others like you make it about how l33t you are or are not and strip all the fun away.

I am not a quitter and never have been but I can't enter a battle alone to face the odds and hope to get in - nor can I find a group because I am not a monk or MM.

I do have a guild that I was going in with, but once I saw how stupid the setup was I left the alliance field and like many others will not be going back till it's fixed....

If ya wanna make a thread about how great it is then do so, no one is stopping you - but I bet ya get a lot more laughs than this thread gets.

And basically what you all are saying is the same as what you say in HoH when you won't take anyone past a rank 3: You aren't good enough, go back to the random arenas!

No one will become skilled without trial and error or without getting the chance to play! Practice makes perfect now stop acting as if you are gods and have never been a newb! We were all newb once, while the hell can't you guys grow up and see that and stop picking on the little guy!

I want my guildies no matter how newb to have every chance even if the guild roster is empty due to finals - so yes I will fight against this stupidity that once used to be fun!

OH and for mister NEWS FLASH up there: Once a quitter always a quitter you get them anywhere you go and no matter what you do! You cannot make someone NOT quit no matter what you change but penalizing them will help more than hurting the little guy who really just wants to play!
You can be as leet or as noob as ya like and if you have it in you to quit just cause you can you always will! But if ya have it in you to learn and no one to teach you, you will never get anywhere!

JPG · May 01, 2006, 10:11 PM // 22:11

/signed

Drokmed · May 01, 2006, 10:22 PM // 22:22

I too think it's rediculous to only allow groups of 4, then not be able to work with the other two groups.

Technically, we know it works. Why they would remove this feature just doesn't make sense.

We'd like it back...